1908 Messina destruction: earthquake or guns?

KorbenDallas

Negotiator
Messages
5,116
Reactions
21,420
Once coincidences start piling up, it's time for a suspicion. In my recent thread titled "Real mission of the 1907-1909 US Great White Fleet, what was it?" I pointed out an interesting catastrophic event which occurred during the voyage of the fleet. There could be more, but I did not specifically look for additional ones yet. If somebody else wants to assist, be my guest.

The squadrons were manned by 14,000 sailors. They covered some 43,000 nautical miles (80,000 km) and made twenty port calls on six continents.
dp-nws-great-white-fleet-20131215.jpg

The 1908 Messina earthquake occurred on 28 December in Sicily and Calabria. Coincidentally, the great White Fleet of the United States was where? It appears it was right there. Coincidence? Could be.

Below you can see the cut out from the White Fleet Itinerary. Just below it, is an image of a part of the Fleet's route.

white fleet tour 1907-09_1.jpg

Great_white_fleet_map_1.png

I doubt we have very accurate data as far as times and locations go. Yet, we can place the Great White Fleet within a week, and definitely in the area of the so-called Messian earthquake.

1908 Messina Earhquake

Messiana.jpg

The 1908 Messina earthquake (also known as the 1908 Messina and Reggio earthquake) occurred on 28 December in Sicily and Calabria, southern Italy with a moment magnitude of 7.1 and a maximum Mercalli intensity of XI (Extreme). The cities of Messina and Reggio Calabria were almost completely destroyed and between 75,000 and 200,000 lives were lost.

Messina Before the Earthquake
messina_before_15.jpg

messina_before_1.jpg messina_before_3.jpg messina_before_4.jpg messina_before_6.jpg messina_before_7.jpg messina_before_8.jpg
messina_before_9.jpg messina_before_10.jpg messina_before_11.jpg messina_before_12.jpg messina_before_14.jpg
messina_before_13.jpg messina_before_5.jpg messina_before_2.jpg messina_earthquake_5_1.jpg
KD: It would be interesting to figure out what historically important objects could be located in Messina. We can see that "Tartarian" type of architecture was destroyed, but was there anything else to it?

Messina After the Earthquake

1908-messina-terremoto-del-28-dicembre1.jpg

mess3.jpg messina_earthquake_1.jpg messina_earthquake_2.jpg messina_earthquake_3.jpg messina_earthquake_4.jpg messina_earthquake_5_2.jpg messina_earthquake_6.jpg messina_earthquake_7.jpg messina_earthquake_8.jpg messina_earthquake_9.jpg messina_earthquake_11.jpg messina_earthquake_14.jpg messina_earthquake_5.png messina_earthquake_15.jpg messina_earthquake_16.jpg messina_earthquake_17.jpg messina_earthquake_18.jpg messina_earthquake_19.jpg
messina_earthquake_12.jpg messina_earthquake_10.jpg messina_earthquake_13.jpg

Messina - Star City
Being an old town allegedly established in 8th century BC, Messina used to be shaped and bordered according to the most prominent star-shaped designs. Of course in reality it could be 8th century AD, but that's a separate story.

Not much of the star design has survived, but you can still see some left on the google earth image.


ART

I found a few somewhat older etchings/paintngs of Messina. Not sure if they could be useful, but are still an interesting bunch to take a look at.

messina_P_1.jpg messina_P_2.jpg Messine_1.jpg Messine_2.jpg

Insanity patients being arrested after the earthquake in Messina by Max Beckmann
(what's really depicted here)
insanity patients being arrested after the earthquake in Messina by Max Beckmann.jpg


Plan of reconstruction after the Earthquake
Unexecuted Beaux-Arts plan for the reconstruction of the port, 1909. I do not know what people in 1909 thought of their abilities, but execution of this 1909 plan in 2018 would probably take a few days, a couple of dollars and a whole lot of infrastructure support .

La_nuova_cortina_del_porto_di_Messina.jpg


* * * * *
KD thoughts: I don't know, whether it was an Earthquake, or them Sicilians simply made a mistake of not building a Welcome Arch for the Great White Fleet. The kind of Arch, a whole bunch of other visited countries greeted the members of the Fleet with. And only history knows whether those were Arches of Triumph, or Arches of Defeat.

white_fleet_1.png

white_fleet_3.jpeg

white_fleet_welcome_arch_1.jpeg white_fleet_welcome_arch_2.jpg white_fleet_welcome_arch_3.jpg white_fleet_welcome_arch_4.jpg


An Afterthought
Could they be after this?
Star_city_messina_2_13.jpg


EVIDENCE OF BOMBARDMENT?
There appears to be no official documented proof directly suggesting any wrongdoing. Besides little things which start to come out during a prolonged research. Like the below 1909 "Catalog of Copyright Entries". Unless it pertains to the Revolutionary Bombardment of 1848, this could be our only direct evidence that Messina was destroyed by gunfire, rather than by an earthquake.

messina_bombardment_2.png

messina_bombardment.png

messina_bombardment_1.png

Yet, there still might be an unknown factor. Otherwise why would we have texts like the ones below? Could there be an additional player in all of this?

messina_bombardment_3.png

messina_bombardment_4.png


It gets even crazier...

messina_bombardment_5.png

Officially, first sentry gun prototypes were developed in 1973.​

A sentry gun is a weapon that is automatically aimed and fired at targets that are detected by sensors. The earliest functioning military sentry guns were the close-in weapon systems point-defense weapons, such as the Phalanx CIWS, used for detecting and destroying short range incoming missiles and enemy aircraft first, used exclusively on naval assets, and now also as land-based defenses
 

Apollyon

Well-known member
Messages
243
Reactions
1,239
Very good work. In my opinion what you have uncovered is the mechanism by which the mega-state confiscated its property from the invading red army hordes. For an analogy say you build a beautiful home and one day Some people walk in and demand the deed, they outnumber you 4 to 1 and are strong and ruthless and do not intend to use your home for anything good. Do you just give them your property your assets your technology? Or do you burn it to the ground?
 

BStankman

Well-known member
Messages
670
Reactions
3,273
Yes, this is truly fantastic detective work. It appears to be the foundation of US international policy.

Bringing "democracy" by bombing into oblivion historic sites that do not fit the Scaliger timeline. And killing as many as possible.
We still have this happening today in Lybia and Syria, which have "roman" ruins that are larger and far superior to Rome.

I guess if you come to heel and build an arch, your are agreeing to have your history buried with less bombing and murder.
 
Last edited:

whitewave

Well-known member
Messages
1,570
Reactions
5,440
The insanity picture was interesting. Why do so many people have their shirts off? The event took place in December. Maybe they got sprayed with some psychoactive substance and people went crazy. It was apparently bad enough that there was consideration of abandoning the town and burying it in lime! Did they get a hold of bathsalts and turn cannibal? How bad does it have to be over there that observers be willing not only to abandon them to their fate but also to bury the rest in lime?
 
OP
KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

Negotiator
Messages
5,116
Reactions
21,420
Funny how it is 1908 (barely 100 years ago), and it appears we have a totally different perception on the events of the time. I have to admit, I was rather surprised to stumble into that last piece of bombardment info, but it made me wonder (like so many things recently)... what coordination had to take place for none of this info to be public.

There has to be something VERY serious out there, for the rulers of this world to pull something like this off.
 

whitewave

Well-known member
Messages
1,570
Reactions
5,440
Is it possible that volcanoes, in addition to their usual spray of gases, could occasionally spew some insanity-producing gas to cause what we see in the picture?
 
OP
KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

Negotiator
Messages
5,116
Reactions
21,420
Is it possible that volcanoes, in addition to their usual spray of gases, could occasionally spew some insanity-producing gas to cause what we see in the picture?
Hypothetically everything is possible, obviously. In reality I would look for a more traditional answer like poisonous gas may be.

I’m curious why they refer to it mentioning Pompeii the way they do. Opens the door for further Pompeii investigation as well.

But in general those headline cutouts are just creepy.
 

PrincepAugus

Well-known member
Messages
463
Reactions
980
I don't think they're any natural psychotic gases in the world. However, if we are to use the EU theory, then the intense electromagnetic discharge that occurs when a volcano erupts can make people go crazy.

Though with the fleets of ships at the area, I wouldn't think the tragedy in Messina is natural.
 
OP
KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

Negotiator
Messages
5,116
Reactions
21,420
Correct me if I’m wrong, but there was no reported volcano activity in the area. It was an earthquake.
 

BStankman

Well-known member
Messages
670
Reactions
3,273
high caliber guns produce insanity aka shell shock
Exactly. This is pre WW1 so before the term shell shock. And civilians.
If I we never heard of PTSD and I tried to decribe it to you, and then you tried to paint it, would it look like this?

These are veterans of the Iran-Iraq war suffering from PTSD during Desert Storm. Surrendering in their underwear.

ceasefire.jpg
 

whitewave

Well-known member
Messages
1,570
Reactions
5,440

Lipari islands have sunk beneath the sea and all their 28,000 inhabitants have perished. 1/2/1909. You'd think that would merit more than a headline. This wiki reference mentions a comet. "The smoky fires of the sunset, the prophecies of our day, the apparition from on high of the menacing comet with a tail, the ruthless end of Messina (elemental forces are not to be overcome) and the incessant roar of the machine forging destruction day and night. Alexandr Blok Vozmezdie (1910-20). 28,000 dead in Lipari, 110,000 dead in Reggio, 200,000 perished in Sicily and Calabria January 2-4, 1909.

In England prevailed epidemic madness in 1355. In 1373 raged an epidemic madness among the lower people in England; and in 1374 a similar disorder prevailed in France and Italy.

Seneca mentions that a flock of 600 sheep were killed by the pestiferous vapor, discharged during the earthquake in Italy. "Pestiferous vapors could arise from stagnant water or unburied bodies or could even escape directly from the earth during an earthquake." Death and Apocalypse in the Middle Ages. (I don't know why I said volcanoes earlier; I meant earthquake-doh).
Noah Webster's Brief History of Epidemics and Pestilential Diseases ****It's not really brief-over 300 pages****

P.S. Lipari islands seems to have come back. I'm guessing when they said "sunk" they meant a tsunami.
 

gregory5564

Well-known member
Messages
39
Reactions
199
The use of old copyright entries to discover traces of events which were later erased seems like a brilliant technique. So if I understand correctly, these entries are the titles of articles which were published shortly after the events, but we no longer have the contents of the articles, is that right?
 
OP
KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

Negotiator
Messages
5,116
Reactions
21,420
@whitewave - you are brilliant. The islands might be back up, but the people are most likely dead. Go figure today.

We have this interesting way to explain thing, which I have seen in Wikipedia several times already, where they deny events. I wish was keeping track.
On New Year's Day in 1909, a rumor appeared in international newspapers that the Aeolian (Lipari) Islands had been "swallowed up by the sea" during a time of volcanic activity. While communication with the islands was interrupted for a time, they were not otherwise lost.
The use of old copyright entries to discover traces of events which were later erased seems like a brilliant technique. So if I understand correctly, these entries are the titles of articles which were published shortly after the events, but we no longer have the contents of the articles, is that right?
This is my understanding. I tried to find the actual articles, but failed. The only mentions are within these copyright lists.
 

dreamtime

Well-known member
Messages
594
Reactions
3,261
There's a reference on one of the 1300 Mappa Mundi (Medieaval World Map) that the Aeolian Islands just came out of the sea recently.
The Aeolian Islands are named after Aeolus, son of the hippote, who the poets declared king of the winds and governor of those provinces, and because he predicted the future wind direction from the fog, therefore he was regarded by the ignorant as one who had had the winds under his control. These islands are also called "volcanic" islands because they are supposed to breathe fire like Etna. There are 9 islands, each with its own name. The first is Lipari, who was called Lipari by a certain Liparen who reigned there before Eolus. The second is called Hiera because it has very high mountains. The others are Strongyle, Didyme, Eriphusa, Hephaistia, Phaenicusa, Euonymus, Kesselklang. Because they glow at night, they are called Aeolian or volcanic islands. The Aeolian Islands did not exist from the beginning; they only emerged from the sea later and have remained so to this day.
Ebstorf Map
 
Last edited:
Top