What did George Bernard Shaw mean in his Saint Joan

KorbenDallas

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#1
George Bernard Shaw has the following exchange in his Saint Joan. Apparently the Nobleman had hard time considering some people as French, or English. Any ideas as to why?

THE CHAPLAIN. He is only a Frenchman, my lord.

THE NOBLEMAN. A Frenchman! Where did you pick up that expression? Are these Burgundians and Bretons and Picards and Gascons beginning to call themselves Frenchmen, just as our fellows are beginning to call themselves Englishmen? They actually talk of France and England as their countries. Theirs, if you please! What is to become of me and you if that way of thinking comes into fashion?
 
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KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

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To me it looks like this "Nobleman" does not consider Burgundians and Bretons and Picards and Gascons to be Frenchmen. Same goes for some "fellows" in England. The question is why?
 
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KorbenDallas

KorbenDallas

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In the Bohemian Grove videos they worship an owl. So I’m not sure that Tartarian is a good thing :)
 

whitewave

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The 5th century Gallo-Roman poet and landowner Sidonius, who at one point lived with the Burgundians, described them as a long-haired people of immense physical size:
"Why... do you [an obscure senator by the name of Catullinus] bid me compose a song dedicated to Venus... placed as I am among long-haired hordes, having to endure Germanic speech, praising often with a wry face the song of the gluttonous Burgundian who spreads rancid butter on his hair? ... You don't have a reek of garlic and foul onions discharged upon you at early morn from ten breakfasts, and you are not invaded before dawn... by a crowd of giants."[12]
The others mentioned by the Nobleman seemed to be nomadic tribes or refugees running from Roman conquest. The Gascons are an interesting "melting pot" of tribes that withstood the might of the Roman army for quite a while and whose lands were considered a prize by the Romans. One wonders what sort of technology they possessed to hold their own against the Roman military.

An owl was generally considered a symbol of Minerva worship. "She was the virgin goddess of music, poetry, medicine, wisdom, commerce, weaving, and the crafts.[3] She is often depicted with her sacred creature, an owl usually named as the "owl of Minerva",[4] which symbolized her association with wisdom and knowledge as well as, less frequently, the snake and the olive tree." The Roman Minerva was apparently adopted from the earlier Estrucan Minrva. " Menrva (also spelled Menerva) was an Etruscan goddess of war, art, wisdom, and medicine. She contributed much of her character to Roman Minerva, when that culture evolved. Often, she is depicted in a more essentially Etruscan style, as a lightning thrower. Martianus mentions her as one of nine Etruscan lightning deities." (Associated with the 9 Worthies?).

U.S. Capitol building held by an owl.
Owls on the dollar bill.
A copper weathervane, from Pennsylvania depicting Lady Liberty weather vane; she wears a PHRYGIAN cap and holds the American flag. (Museum of Fine Arts)

The Seal of California depicts the Goddess Minerva. In the early twentieth century, Manuel José Estrada Cabrera, President of Guatemala, tried to promote a "Worship of Minerva" in his country. According to John Robison's Proofs of a Conspiracy (1798), the third degree of the Bavarian Illuminati was called Minerval or Brother of Minerva, in honor of the goddess of learning. Later, this title was adopted for the first initiation of Aleister Crowley's OTO rituals. Minerva is displayed on the Medal of Honor, the highest military decoration awarded by the United States government. Minerva is featured in the logo of the Max Planck Society. Minerva alongside Mars is displayed on the cap badge of the Artists Rifles Territorial SAS Regiment of the British Army. Kingston upon Hull's oldest Masonic lodge is named The Minerva Lodge. Minerva is the patron goddess of the Theta Delta Chi and Sigma Alpha Epsilon fraternities, the Phi Theta Kappa Honor Society, and the Kappa Kappa Gamma and Delta Sigma Theta.

For supposedly Christian nations we certainly give much homage to the old gods.

As for your original question about why they might think that way, the next few lines of the text address the issue. What is to become of me and you if that way of thinking comes into fashion? Men can not serve 2 masters. If this cant of serving their country once takes hold of them, goodbye to the authority of their feudal lords, and goodbye to the authority of the Church. That is goodbye to you and me.

It looks like then (as now) the regions we've come to know as France and England (home of the Franks and Anglos, respectively) had an immigration problem and were absorbed and culturally consumed by them.
 
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