The "tic tac," "gimbal," and friends

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A lot of you have probably seen these before, especially since the first was released in December 2017 and they've recently been in various news outlets.

The tic tacs
"It wasn't a fleeting thing, it wasn't a weather balloon, it was an object. I've got a lot of experience. I looked at it for over five minutes and I chased it, I got within a half mile of it, and it had no wings, it had no rotors, you can look in the video, it had no known propulsion system and there's no plume coming out, there's no heat signature - nothing." - Commander David Fravor


In early November of 2004, a US Navy strike force which included the USS Nimitz carrier and the USS Princeton missile cruiser was conducting training exercise about a hundred miles southwest of San Diego. For days the Fire Control staff of the Princeton had been detecting up to ten Anomalous Aerial Vehicles (AAV) with their SPY-1 radar, said to have been the "most sophisticated and powerful tactical radar on the planet." The AAVs kept appearing over the same spot over the ocean, "a Lat/Long about 30NM off the coast of Baja, roughly 70nm southwest of Tijuana." They had been coming down from above 80,000 feet and would proceed to drop from 80,000 down to 20,000 feet and hover (sometimes for 3 hours), and from there would either rapidly ascend again or drop out of radar range. They continued to track these AAVs, which were able to move with speeds, turn rates, and accelerations "faster than any known friendly or threat aircraft. Impossibly fast."

On November 14th, 2004, an air defense training exercise was being conducted with aviators from the US Navy and US Marine Corps. This was the first time they had manned airplanes in the air when an AAV showed up, so Princeton took the opportunity to use the planes to go examine the AAV contact, at the time one was hovering at 20,000 feet over the usual spot. A USMC Hornet was contacted by the Princeton to go investigate and was asked what ordnance he had aboard, to which he replied that he had none. The Princeton was also trying to direct an E-2C Hawkeye which had been providing control for the training exercises, the AAV did not appear on the E-2C's radar sweep, but they were able to pick up a faint contact when the Princeton gave them the exact coordinates. The Princeton gave up on the E-2C and began vectoring a flight of two US Navy F/A-18 Super Hornets towards the AAV. (One of these Super Hornets was piloted by Commander Dave Fravor)

The USMC Hornet was able to see the Super Hornets on his radar but not the AAV. The Princeton directed him to break off and return to the ship, but the pilot figured he'd take a quick look before heading back. The sea was reportedly calm that day and the pilot "saw a disturbance on the surface of the ocean. A round section of turbulent water about 50-100 meters in diameter." The Super Hornets arrived and were not picking up the AAV on their radar and the Princeton called a "merge plot," meaning their aircrafts were so close to the AAV that they couldn't be differentiated on the radar and they needed to watch out or risk a collision.

As they looked around they saw the disturbance on the water, began wondering what had caused it, and then they finally laid eyes on the AAV: an oblong, smooth, white, featureless object, estimated about 46 feet long, with no visible windows/nacelles/wings/or propulsion systems. It was hovering about 50 feet over the ocean and making "minor lateral movements while staying at a low altitude over the disk of turbulent water." Fravor and others compared the shape to that of a tic tac mint.

Fravor radioed his wingman and said he was going to go down and investigate and the other plane stayed circling above, Fravor noticed the AAV had reacted and had turned towards their plane, and it began ascending towards them. Fravor dropped the nose of his plane and prepared to cut across towards the AAV, the AAV got in front of the plane's nose and suddenly took off, accelerating away at multiple Machs; the other Super Hornet's crew and even the Princeton's radar lost contact with it. Fravor turned around to investigate the ocean disturbance and the water was calm with no evidence of it nor the AAV.

The Super Hornets talked with the Princeton and it was decided they would go rendevous at the CAP (combat air patrol) point they had been using during their training. The Princeton's operator said in disbelief, "Sir, you won't believe it, but that thing is at your CAP point." The CAP point was 60 miles away and the AAV had arrived there in less than a minute and was hovering around 20,000 feet. The AAV had disappeared by the time the Super Hornets arrived, and they headed back to the Nimitz.

Training was continuing through the day and the first pilots informed the next crews of what they had seen. Knowing that it was out there, these aviators were more prepared to deal with the AAV and were actively looking for it as they flew to the CAP point, their plane was also equipped with a FLIR (Forward Looking Infrared) pod. It did appear at the same CAP point, first detected on their radar from around 30 nautical miles away, hovering precisely at the CAP point around 20,000 feet. They tried to lock on several times to no avail, and later during their debrief they said they had witnessed multiple telltale cues of Electronic Attack and "distinct jamming indication" of their plane's systems.

In response to the jamming, they utilized the FLIR pod and recorded the object, as seen in the video above. As they swapped through the TV and IR FLIR settings the AAV suddenly accelerated and zoomed out of sight with incredible speed, and notably there was no visible means on the FLIR of how it was flying nor how it was hovering.

Someone leaked the footage to YouTube a few years after the incident, then it was released in 2017 as the story was made public. There was a recording of the radar as well but it was never released. The story did make some tracks with the media, being featured on the NY Times, Fox News, ABC, NBC, Washington Post, etc. and is still making the rounds over a year later, such as VICE recently interviewing Commander Fravor, where he told them that the AAV was "far beyond the technology that we have."

Fravor agreed to go to the McMenamins UFO Fest in Oregon and do an interview with Jeremy Corbell. When asked if it could have been anything conventional based on its flight characteristics: "This thing just defied [the laws of physics and inertia], it was like left-right, left-right, fore-back, and then when it came, when it decided to come and visit, you know, and mirror us, it just kind of abruptly went boop [he flicks his finger to the side]. That fast. Just boom, and it started moving. We have nothing that can literally just stop, twist, and it's going that fast. It's just, we don't. Not in the air."

According to the Fighter Sweep write-up (which I believe was in February or March 2015 and is mentioned by Fravor in the Corbell interview), he contacted Fravor when preparing to write the article and Fravor informed him the YouTube footage had been removed and that a three letter government agency had recently conducted an investigation into the AAVs and "exhaustively interviewed all parties involved." This included the crew from a submarine that was in the area as part of the Nimitz group, they reported no unidentified sonar contact nor strange underwater noises that day.

The Gimbal and Friends



That government agency investigation of the tic tac likely was tied into more AAVs that were being spotted on a near daily basis by the pilots of the USS Theodore Roosevelt, off the East Coast of the United States between Virginia and Florida, from the Summer of 2014 to March 2015. These AAVs had similar characteristics to the tic tac, they moved at hypersonic speeds with no visible engines or exhaust plumes. One pilot noted that they would also stay in the air for at least 12 hours, "Keeping an aircraft in the air requires a significant amount of energy. With the speeds we observed, 12 hours in the air is 11 hours longer than we’d expect.”

Similar to the tic tac incident, the pilots said they only started seeing the AAVs after their aircraft had their 1980s era radars upgraded, and they initially ignored them as a possible issue with the radar. They kept seeing them, and similar to the tic tac AAV, they were spotted at various altitudes from 30,000 feet down to sea level and could accelerate, slow, and speed back up at hypersonic speed.

One of the pilots tried to "merge" with one and flew under it, he could not see it with his helmet camera though the radar said it was there. Days later he had locked onto one but still could not visually see it. The pilots began speculating they must be from some kind of extremely advanced drone program, that is until one of them nearly had a midair collision with one.

In late 2014, a pilot almost hit into one of the AAVs after it flew past him as he was coming in for a landing. He described it as a "sphere encasing a cube." They filed an aviation flight safety report and became angry as the AAVs being drones became less likely (they figured the government wouldn't send classified drones to get in their way while flying) and that meant their lives were at risk and it was only a matter of time before someone actually hit into one. This anger of the pilots is supposedly what has spurred the Navy into investigating the phenomenon.

The first video above is dubbed the GO FAST, it was a fast moving object with no discernible wings, exhaust, propulsion, etc. The AAV in the Gimbal video is described as a "fleet" of them moving effortlessly against 120 knot winds at 25,000 feet, as the excited crew try to deduce what it is, it begins to rotate and defies both the laws of physics and the principles of aerodynamics. The Gimbal is said to have an "aura" around it on the FLIR footage.

In the interview with the NY Times, the pilots said it was "strange" how the AAVs were "accelerating to hypersonic speed, making sudden stops and instantaneous turns" but none wanted to speculate as to what the AAVs are.

The Navy issued classified guidance on how to report "unexplained aerial phenomena" in response to the Roosevelt incidents. Updated guidance was sent out earlier this year, and in April 2019 the spokesman for office of the deputy chief of naval operations for information warfare vowed to "investigate each and every report" due to safety and security concerns. According to the same article, "these intrusions have been happening on a regular basis since 2014. Recently, unidentified aircraft have entered military-designated airspace as often as multiple times per month."

In summation
  • Up to 10 AAVs were seen simultaneously on the Princeton's radar, they tracked them for several days. The pilots of the Roosevelt reported a "fleet" of them during one recorded and released incident, and had multiple encounters over many months.
  • The flight characteristics of all reported AAVs are "impossible" using conventional propulsion and defy the laws of known physics. (Speculation seems to lean towards some kind of gravity manipulation powering them.) They performed maneuvers with G forces that would almost certainly kill a pilot as far as anyone is aware and were able to operate for many hours at high speeds and after performing energy-intensive actions.
  • There was no visible windows, propulsion, exhaust, vents, wings, tails, rotors, or anything else associated with conventional aircraft, drones, and missiles.
  • There potentially is some kind of underwater object connected to the tic tacs with no info other than it disrupted a large circle of water, it disappeared without a trace soon after they arrived, and the AAVs tended to ascend/descend and hover at various altitudes above where it had been seen. It allegedly was not detected by a submarine's sonar and they did not hear any noise from it.
  • The tic tac AAVs seemed to be under intelligent control, reacting to the aircraft and perhaps even toying with them by going on an intercept course just to zoom away at incredible speed and wait at their CAP point, and it utilized electronic warfare to jam the radar system of the next plane after being spotted.
  • The tic tac somehow slipped by the radar scans of the E-2C, Hornet, and the first two Super Hornets, but whatever baffle or issue is responsible for that did not seem to bother the Princeton's radar as much, and even the E-2C seemed to be capable of detecting it somewhat when focused on the exact coordinates. A decade later, the Roosevelt's pilots only started detecting AAVs in aircraft that had upgraded their radar technology,
  • All these AAVs were seen off the coasts of the USA, the Roosevelt's AAVs were seen up and down the East Coast and the sightings died down as they headed out to sea and got away from the continental US.
  • The US Navy seemingly is acknowledging that these things are real and could pose a hazard to aircraft safety and national security.
  • If they belong to a government, as far as I can tell no one has taken credit for these amazing, high tech aircraft, and if they were made by the US or whomever then they have aircraft toys that are seemingly leagues beyond what the public (and even regular military) has knowledge of.
As you can see, a lot of questions remain unanswered. Primarily, are they real, and if so, what are they? Who created them, and who operates them? Did they continue monitoring the tic tac site after the 2004 incident? How much do the governments actually know about them if they don't belong to any of them?
 

Schism

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As you can see, a lot of questions remain unanswered. Primarily, are they real, and if so, what are they? Who created them, and who operates them? Did they continue monitoring the tic tac site after the 2004 incident? How much do the governments actually know about them if they don't belong to any of them?
I found your post very interesting. I'm not sure how long you've been hanging around this place, how many of the threads contained within the entirety of this site you read, but given the fact that I have been reading, and digesting all of what's contained within this site for months now, I'm starting to look at things completely different than I did prior to.

I've been into the UFO phenomenon for decades, and my views have changed over the years. Several decades ago, I seen at least one thing that I couldn't explain myself. I personally believe that a good amount of what we see actually come from here, whatever this place is. My thoughts on that haven't changed since I began reading this site either.

Given the fact that it generally takes alphabet agencies many years, decades, and so on, to release classified information, I can't help but wonder why this information would be released to the public so swiftly. What's the real MO? Is it another psy-op?

Are some of the released classified documents, video footage, etc, even real to begin with? So much to consider.
 

whitewave

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Apparently, the USAF isn't necessarily apprised of all the goings on in space. In this article about the Space Force was an interesting off-handed remark. "The proposed space corps would absorb the duties of the U.S. Air Force Space Command, a unit inside the Air Force that supports most of the country’s military operations in space and employs about 36,000 people across more than 130 sites around the world. The division would collect space professionals throughout the government into one place. “The military has not done a good enough job looking after space with all its other distracting priorities,” Cooper told Berman last year. “It’s just not getting the attention it deserves.”
What military operations in space are they referring to?
 

aceofarms

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its odd that they knowingly equip their craft with radar that can detect it, it must be on purpose.
maybe in case this technology ever comes into a war space pilots already know how to identify them? Even if they are confused what it is now, being aware of it cuts out the complete shock value of it.
 

WildFire2000

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UFO things aside, my personal feelings on all of this are actually one of awe in how it was released through the MSM (mainstream media) and virtually NO ONE anywhere, at all, picked up on it, discussed it or anything. I don't watch TV or pay attention to the media circus in the US, but I came across the videos through a feed on my phone. I watched it, read a few articles on alternate media sites, read the MSM's take on it just so I had the information that's out there, and then around Thanksgiving of 2017, and again at Christmas dinner with my family in 2017, I brought it all up. My parents who are glued to their News on TV almost 16 hours a day HAD NO IDEA! At all! It completely by-passed their consciousness or awareness or whatever, which I find surprising, given my parents have always been fans of Star Trek and Star Wars and the like. They're also the only people I know in person that have admitted to seeing such a craft in their lifetimes.

So, the government/MSM go for a bit of disclosure, soft or otherwise, to tell people that they've been tracking and searching out UFO's in our atmosphere for AT LEAST a decade and a half, probably more, and no one bothers to pay attention to it. It was barely a blip anywhere at all. After all this time of people talking about aliens and UFO's and space and finding life and all of that, something talks about it officially and it just slips by. I suppose it's from all the movies and everything for the past 20-30 years, everyone is so accustomed to the idea of things from elsewhere (wherever that elsewhere may be) or "non-human" entities, that this isn't actually news to them. Guess the soft-disclosure did it's work.
 

wizz33

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AAITP is sponsored by Podesta aka the right hand man of Clinton, i think it is/was a falsflag to enable president Clinton to do a 1/1000 disclosure.
i think Space Force is hijacking it.
 

trismegistus

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I think anyone interested in this field needs to be very cautious about these "tic tac" videos. UFOs are one of my favorite topics, I think that there is absolutely something to the phenomenon, and that there may be several explanations for different experiences.

I would caution anyone who sees these videos and reads these reports to take them with a grain of salt. Otherwise the implication is that the very same government/military that has spent the last 75 years lying and denying the existence of UFOs has now decided to start telling the truth. Does that not seem fishy?

I know that most on here are intelligent enough to at least be skeptical of something like this, so perhaps I'm preaching to the crowd here. My prediction for this information being disclosed is as follows:

  • Disclose tic-tac videos to gauge public reaction
  • Establish the mainstream UFO narrative
  • Control narrative to diminish outlier experiences that aren't explicitly what the military says are UFOs
  • Drip feed controlled disclosure through various mediums (NYT, mainstream news, ancient aliens, Hollywood)
  • Define UFOs as being extraterrestrials
  • Create narrative in which extraterrestrials mean us harm
  • Use narrative to justify increased military spending on "space defense"
  • Steal more tax payer money for black budget projects
I have half a mind to believe that these "tic tac" craft are simply 50-75 year old Nazi technology still operated by the US/Russia/New Schwabenland, possibly a remnant of the breakaway civilization or black budget military craft.
 
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Schism

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Funny thing about this tic tac UFO video and narrative is that it's currently circulating all over the so called truth community and beyond. Why now?

I would caution anyone who sees these videos and reads these reports to take them with a grain of salt. Otherwise the implication is that the very same government/military that has spent the last 75 years lying and denying the existence of UFOs has now decided to start telling the truth. Does that not seem fishy?
Well said.
Post automatically merged:

Funny thing about this tic tac UFO video and narrative is that it's currently circulating all over the so called truth community and beyond. Why now?
I did some checking, and apparently this tic tac UFO stuff is hitting the truth community scene lately because of a series on the History Channel -

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.history.com/.amp/news/uss-nimitz-2004-tic-tac-ufo-encounter

I watched a recent David Icke video regarding his take on the tic tacks, why this stuff is being released to the public, etc, and he pretty much says the same thing several of us already hit on.

 
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tupperaware

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Funny thing about this tic tac UFO video and narrative is that it's currently circulating all over the so called truth community and beyond. Why now?


Well said.
Post automatically merged:


I did some checking, and apparently this tic tac UFO stuff is hitting the truth community scene lately because of a series on the History Channel -

When Top Gun Pilots Tangled With a Baffling Tic-Tac-Shaped UFO

I watched a recent David Icke video regarding his take on the tic tacks, why this stuff is being released to the public, etc, and he pretty much says the same thing several of us already hit on.

Anything like the super advanced technology required for a "craft" like this would be considered an instant threat and classified unless its "routine" technology to some people in government. Its very simple. The more advanced the technology the more of a threat it is. So its either a complete hoax or truly advanced technology (Earth sourced or not) but "known" to at least some in the U.S. government. I realize this seems like an obvious statement but to me it is very comforting to know that either way we are being lied to "insidiously". Is there anything in the middle I am missing like maybe hardware malfunction? I don't need to know right now what the truth about this is. I am content now, to know I am being lied to.

To put it another way, I know I am being lied to but I am content to wait for much better proof for it being hoax or truth.
 

codis

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Don't know, but somehow this "Niemitz tic tac" report reminds me on the Patriot missiles (or better, rumors about it).
As I heard, this Anti-Missile system is a total failure, and only succeeds against simulated targets. For every real incoming missile, nine simulated one's are added. And thus the Patriot system achieves 90% success rate...
My point: no need for deliberate lies by the radar personnel. No one has seen the real object, only it's "reflections" in a software-based system.
Have I told you I'm in the software development business as well ? (Not military, though...)
 

codis

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There are some people who still think the black triangle aircraft (TR-3B ASTRA) are alien ships.
In one sense, they might be "alien". The first serious triangular planes are the GO 229 by the Horten brothers (i.e. those evil Nazis again).
Like with von Braun's missiles, the technology was paper-clipped, and concealed with a lot of misinformation.
 
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