Tartary - an Empire hidden in history. It was bigger than Russia once...

sonoman

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skip to 1:40.0 to get to the the Swedish translations from old books, very interesting and these guys are on the ball, worth watching in full if you have time IMO


courtesy of GLP bluegroup:
Tartary, the civilization that we erased from history, occupied New York, Chicago, St. Louis, Washington D.C, and many other areas. They were not only all over the United States but all over the world, from the Americas to Europe to Russia, China, Africa, Japan, Australia, and more. You may have seen a number of their amazing and beautiful structures, and perhaps even thought why we seem unable to build them even today. You will not find any photographs or evidence of construction for these buildings and cities, but some of them are still standing. You may even have some in your own city, though most of them were destroyed when this great war was at its peak in the 19th century.
Q Metaphysics: Beyond Reality – The End of Deception and the Rebirth of Humanity

good read on the subject by an author from an alternate universe.

from "A New Law Dictionary" 6th Edition 1750

15776
 
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NowhereMan

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Summary: I think there is enough circumstantial evidence to justify a deeper look into who fought who, and why this Tartary country is so little known about.

And the main question out of this all should be what is the purpose of misleading generations of people? It appears there is something tremendously serious hidden in our recent history.
I was looking through an old history book I have from 1832 for any references to the Tartars, and found a single reference on page 259 to the Tartars that may be worth researching further. It reads:

In the fifteenth century, John Basilowitz redeemed the empire from its subjection to the Tartars, and united the greater part of the country under one monarchy.

I have so many more unanswered questions now, due to this lone sentence. Who was John Basilowitz? What does it mean that the Russian empire was under subjection to the Tartars? How did he redeem the empire from the Tartars? What about the Tartars made him do it? When was the empire redeemed? What was the structure of the country prior to being united under one monarchy? and so on and so on...

Yet another fragment of a potentially destroyed or forgotten history, i guess.

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sonoman

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hey NoWhereMan & welcome to SH

What does it mean that the Russian empire was under subjection to the Tartars? How did he redeem the empire from the Tartars?
the way I read that is it wasnt part of the Monarhcy/Empire until it was no longer subject to Tartarian rule. or IOW, thats when Tartaria was finally conquered there. before, it was deemed to Tartary until it was 're deemed' to that Monarch

great find.
 
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Ice Nine

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Awesome find @NowhereMan (y)
I goggled his name, and don't take goggles alternate spellings. John Basilowitz was a Tzar of Russia, who knew. I wasn't able to save any of book pages, you'll have to look for yourselves.

Oh I can link them however. there is some pretty good info buried in these old books!

Czars of Muscovy
Astracan Tartars ransacked Moscow ~ page 514 This is pretty great information

Czar John Bafilowitz don't forget their f read like our s now. This must be the book you read.

I'm reading a fascinating book
View of the Russian Empire: During the Reign of Catharine the Great ..., Volume 1 1800

Tartarian tombs go to page 448 Nations of The Empire, the last paragraph on the page talks about Tartian Tombs filled with treasures, gold, silver copper and "The greatest antiquity of the tombs is eleven hundred years, the latest four hundred". "tartarian tombs are located on the Volga and in Siberia." "weapons, military trophies ornaments of dress, coins."

Tartary it talked about a lot in this book.
 
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maxresde

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I was just going to post these couple of quotes I just noticed in something I was reading. However, I wanted to point our something from the original post here. In the image of a page from a book there, it says:

'The country of Tartary called Great Tartary, to distinguish it from the lesser, in Europe'

What Tartary was in Europe?

Anyway, the below quotes are from a history blog I was just reading. Sorry if someone posted it already.
======================
Moreover, Basil is not the only Englishman known to have been living among the Mongols during the mid-thirteenth century. Ivo of Narbonne, for example, reported in a letter copied by Matthew Paris in his Chronica Majora that the 'prince of Dalmatia' captured eight fugitives in 1242 during the surprise withdrawal of the Mongols from Central Europe, just as they were at the gates of Vienna, and that these captives included 'an Englishman' who
had twice come as an envoy and interpreter from the king of Tattars to the king of Hungary, and plainly threatened and warned them of the evils which afterwards happened, unless he should give up himself and his kingdom to be subject to the Tattars.(6)
This English envoy of the Mongols (Tatars/'Tartars') was apparently an exile from England who had lost all he owned to gambling at Acre, Israel, and then wandered 'in a shameful state of want' further east into modern Iraq and beyond before the Mongols persuaded him to join them due to his apparent skill with languages, at which point he then travelled with them until he returned to Europe and was finally captured in Austria. Given that he had clearly travelled huge distances with the Mongols and, most especially, his role as envoy and interpreter for the Mongol khan, it seems possible that he was an earlier English visitor than Basil to the Mongol capital of Karakorum, Mongolia.
=========
For example, in 1313 the royal household records for Edward II record a visit to England by an ambassador of 'the emperor of the Tartars',
=========
Caitlin Green
 

makzpj

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I have no idea what language they spoke in Tartaria, but examining this 1785 Japanese map leads me to believe that it could be written in Chinese.



It might be difficult to distinguish, especially if you don't know what you're looking for, but there are two scripts on the map. One that looks like this タルタリア and one that looks like this 韃靼. The former is katakana, the latter is Chinese (which functions in Asia pretty much like Latin functions in Europe). Katakana is used on the map as a pronunciation guide and for foreign locations that don't use the Chinese writing system (which has some potentially interesting implications for bits of Japan and Korea there, but that's a different topic).

Both of those words in bold are names for Tartaria, but the Chinese suggests that the Tartars referred to their own land as Tartar or Tatar.

Pronunciations of 韃靼 in various languages of the region:
  • Dada - Mandarin
  • Taatdaat - Cantonese
  • Daldal - Korean
But could the "ia/n" on the end actually have come from Chinese too?

Pronunciations of 韃靼人 (Tartarian) in various languages of the region:
  • Dadaren - Mandarin
  • Taatdaatyan - Cantonese
  • Daldalin - Korean
"Who are those people?"
"Oh, they're Dadaren!"
"Tartarian?"
"...Sure!"
Expanding on this, if we decompose 韃靼 we get:

韃 Region
靼 Tanned or smooth leather

Just in case this gives us another clue.
 

Mabzynn

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I wasn't aware that Peking/Beijing suffered a catastrophe in 1836 that sounds an awful lot like a mud flood.

Seems to be a copied article from another source which only complicates the matter. But good references to Tartaria as well -



"In our issue 423 of Tuesday, April 26, we announce with reference to the general newspaper of France the appalling catastrophe of the collapse of Beijing; and it seemed to us convenient to give our readers an idea of that rich population, turned today into a puddle of fetid water so that they may admire as nostoros?, the force of the natural causes that produce the subsidence and other phenomena of nature.

Beijing, capital of the whole Chinese empire and ordinary residence of the emperors, was located on a very fertile plain, 20 leagues away N. of the great wall that separates the boundaries of the Tartarian empire: this wall of admirable factory of stone is 500 leagues long: the capital formed a square, divided into two cities. The part where the emperor's palace was called the Tartara city, because the houses were given to the Tartars when the family that the present queen ascended to the throne and these not allowing the Chinese to live in. the city, forced them to settle outside the walls where another was erected soon after; and having joined this one to the other, it became of both a whole of irregular form, and of six leguas of enclosure. The walls and doors of Pekin, had the amazing height of 50 cubits, so that they hid the city; and so wide that sentries on horseback were placed in them, who climbed their posts along long coastal roads. The doors were new, without any ornament of statues or sculpture, all its beauty."

Everything seems off from the generic translation - maybe someone else can make more sense of this information.
-----

There was another strange item that I have not been able to square away and that's while searching for articles I randomly encountered a story about a Khan of Cuba but foolishly did not screenshot/bookmark it.

Instead:
Cooper's Clarksburg Registry 1854
16664


16661

Cooper's Clarksburg register. (Clarksburg, Va. [W. Va.]) 1851-1861, April 12, 1854, Image 1

Maybe I'm just ignorant to history of this period but very little is to be found on the Peace of Kianardgi(Kanardgi) maybe there's more info available for Russians. It seems to be interchangeable with the:

16663

other sources don't indicate the Cuban exception.

But this does happen to be the year Cuba builds a star fort:
La Cabaña - Wikipedia

16653

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baladelidela

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Hello everyone, I have been looking in to this Tartaria "Tartariet in Swedish" the last weeks. I have been checking documents and trying to find more clues in old books and maps. I'm not expert in old Swedish but i can understand a little bit. Old English is more easy for me to read.
I have seen some connections between old fortresses and different old Swedish buildings and im thinking its possible they were already here before. The same structure as the rest of antique buildings around the world. I have also found star forts or similar forts. A simple google search will line different pictures of Swedish castle or forts, also ancient pictures is possible Sök i Suecians bildskatt
I have looked trough all pictures and i found a few that could suggest a flud or that indicate high water levels. I dont know the background of these pictures so don't take it as proof. Also i found pictures with the 3 Swedish crowns including similar looking animal as the "tartaria flag"
At the moment I'm reading a book, Modern Part of an Univerfal hiftory from the earlieft accounts to the prefent time, part Hiftory of the Kingdom of Sweden. (So far I have learned new meanings for words I did't knew existed) Same as before I don't know how reliable this book is but it mentions exorcism, rothchild, indoctrination, tatary. And some kind of accident of a more fatal nature contributed to the kings losses.
I need to continue read this to get a better summery of the story. Some pictures i found on suecia.kb.se

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whitewave

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The Royal Military Chronicles: Or British Officers Monthly, vol. 6, page 268 The brief synopsis you read is just an introduction to each chapter of the proceeding book. It gives a chronicle of the military campaigns, rulers, politics of the various engagements in Turkey, Cuba, Tartary, etc. Also included in the chapters are details (field manual instructions) on building "fascines", land mines and other information useful to the soldier. This was from 1742 to the mid 1800's. Wasn't aware they had land mines in 1742. There are details of the campaigns waged in and by Russia (and Detroit, of all places) in 1812 which may be of interest to some readers.
Excerpt from Chapter 5 synopsis: "[Field Marshal] Suwarow is sent into the Crimea and is present at the elevation of Schabin Schiray, to the dignity of Khan. He goes to Pultowa where he is attacked by an inflammatory fever. Rejoins his corps on the Cuban and erects fortifications on the bank. ...Goes to the Crimea after the departure of Count P. and received a command. The Porte disturbed at the appointment of a new Khan. ...The Attukays make irruptions into the Cuban. Schabin Schiray is acknowledged Khan by the Grand Signor."

Cuban is one of 2 main rivers flowing into the Azov. (On the old maps it's spelled Kuban) The other being the Don. It's not the Cuba that's 90 miles from Florida. (I didn't know either and had to look it up). There are maps showing its location but they're too big to upload and the ones that aren't too big are too small to be readable. If you want to confirm you can check out the image from page 645 of '[Travels through the Southern Provinces of the Russian Empire in 1793 and 1794. Translated from the German [by F. W. Blagdon]]' . Chapter 6 of the second link is all about the defeat of the Nogay Tartars. Cossocks made treaties with the Tartars but didn't think they could trust them and so made plans to disarm and relocate them to a wasteland area and kill those who resisted. (They just keep recycling the same tyranny, don't they?)
 

Mabzynn

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The Royal Military Chronicles: Or British Officers Monthly, vol. 6, page 268 The brief synopsis you read is just an introduction to each chapter of the proceeding book. It gives a chronicle of the military campaigns, rulers, politics of the various engagements in Turkey, Cuba, Tartary, etc. Also included in the chapters are details (field manual instructions) on building "fascines", land mines and other information useful to the soldier. This was from 1742 to the mid 1800's. Wasn't aware they had land mines in 1742. There are details of the campaigns waged in and by Russia (and Detroit, of all places) in 1812 which may be of interest to some readers.
Excerpt from Chapter 5 synopsis: "[Field Marshal] Suwarow is sent into the Crimea and is present at the elevation of Schabin Schiray, to the dignity of Khan. He goes to Pultowa where he is attacked by an inflammatory fever. Rejoins his corps on the Cuban and erects fortifications on the bank. ...Goes to the Crimea after the departure of Count P. and received a command. The Porte disturbed at the appointment of a new Khan. ...The Attukays make irruptions into the Cuban. Schabin Schiray is acknowledged Khan by the Grand Signor."

Cuban is one of 2 main rivers flowing into the Azov. (On the old maps it's spelled Kuban) The other being the Don. It's not the Cuba that's 90 miles from Florida. (I didn't know either and had to look it up). There are maps showing its location but they're too big to upload and the ones that aren't too big are too small to be readable. If you want to confirm you can check out the image from page 645 of '[Travels through the Southern Provinces of the Russian Empire in 1793 and 1794. Translated from the German [by F. W. Blagdon]]' . Chapter 6 of the second link is all about the defeat of the Nogay Tartars. Cossocks made treaties with the Tartars but didn't think they could trust them and so made plans to disarm and relocate them to a wasteland area and kill those who resisted. (They just keep recycling the same tyranny, don't they?)
Thank you for this. I also realized the town is now Kaynardzha, which explains the original treaty name.
 

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