Dinosauria: Fact or Fiction?

whitewave

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Better yet, they weren't found for the entirety of human history (although bones of giant humans have been long recorded) until the 19th century and now they're popping up all over the place. Even if it were possible for dinosaur (or any) bones to remain intact in the elements for 65 MILLION years they would have to be buried so far down that it would be unlikely we'd find them by scratching the surface.
 

trismegistus

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Very well said, I didn't know that new dinosaurs are found every week, these claims are becoming more and more falacious, literally by the week!

What a load of drivel. Pig headed, egotistical, halfwits with about as much common sense as a class of 5 year olds with a supply teacher.
Funny you say this, I have a vivid memory of elementary school that strangely applies to this conversation.

The teacher decided we were going to do presentations on dinosaurs, each kid got assigned a different dinosaur going through the alphabet. Best believe I wanted that T. Rex.

What I got was:

Yangchuanosaurus
1920px-Allosaurus_Revised.jpgYangchuanosaurus_zigongensis.jpg
Yangchuanosaurus is an extinct genus of metriacanthosaurid theropod dinosaur that lived in China during the Bathonian and Callovian stages of the Middle Jurassic, and was similar in size and appearance to its North American and European relative, Allosaurus. It hails from the Upper Shaximiao Formation and was the largest predator in a landscape that included the sauropods Mamenchisaurus and Omeisaurus and the stegosaurs Chialingosaurus, Tuojiangosaurus and Chungkingosaurus. It was named after the area in which was discovered, Yongchuan, in China.

You're right - this dinosaur's existence is a load of drivel. And the rest of the lot mentioned on Wiki is even worse :ROFLMAO:
 

Onijunbei

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Im confused... Oil is made from dinosaurs... and we can find their bones close to the surface... But if I want oil I gotta dig down 3000 to 6000 feet to find it?

So the mud flood covers up like whole buildings but not dino bones?
 

Radal16

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Excellent post, TH Dialectic! Well written and researched.

Oh, I should also add that I've been in the Smithsonian's Museum Support Center and been in the area where they keep the dinosaur fossils. All of them are either in crates or in the plaster shipping molds, none were out in the open on the shelves. At least not that I remember, it's been a while since I interned there.
 

Dudermensch

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I am aware of enormous fakery supporting evolution theory (piltdown hoax) and I am also aware of past and current psychological operations against truthers (psychedelics, mysticism, flat earth, mandela effect…to name a few) The dinosaur hoax has no whistleblowers from a century ago, or at least I did not find them when I looked into this topic a year ago. Now a Chinese book written around year 300 by Chang Qu reported the discovery of dragon bones. And allegedly there is a long history of the Chinese using these dragon bones in medicine. In Europe the bones were believed to be that of biblical giants. A partial femur was recovered from a quarry in 1676 England. A dude named Plot from Oxford (mildly suspicious) originally thought it was from a big animal, but eventually concluded it must be a giant. In 1699 a buddy of Newton published the first scientism paper on what would eventually be called dinosaurs. So they did not invent the term dinosaur and only then find the bones…that is not the story unless you can prove the encyclopedias with references wrong. In 1800 Culvier found and named the ptero-dacty and Culvier was the main dude establishing extinction as accepted fact so this would be the guy to debunk, he looks fairly clean to me. And as the official story goes, in 1815 a Rev. Buckland starts categorizing dino bones as extinct animals. So note that it wasn’t until 1842 that Richard Owen coined the term dinosaur. Owen was putting these bones (or fake bones) on display in London. In 1858 dino bones were found in NJ, and allegedly it was an entire skeleton (the first entire skeleton was found in 1834 England). In 1877 there was a so-called 30 year “bone war”, with lots of drawings about where the head and tail and brain should be. This war was between 2 guys named Cope and Marsh, and supposedly these 2 guys unearthed and defined 142 new species, Marsh’s bones have been on display ever since at the Peabody Museum at Yale. The first mention of Dino’s in popular media was by Dickens 1842. Some shady company I admit. If the Chinese thing can be established and Culvier checks out then most of the hoax arguments fall flat.. The 300 AD text by Chang Qu is on archive.org and this is a plausible explanation for dragons across different cultures. It is the sheer size of this psyop that would be stunning because I think it would trump most other psyops in history for its unmitigated success…allegedly a hundred thousand fake fossilized bones, buried by clever illuminati before being “discovered” by armies of paleontologists dupes? Or, all fraternity brothers without a single whistleblower? With zero Christian crusaders around writing books and exposing the forgeries? Find me some of those and I will reconsider. Modern vids of new dinosaur finds look real to me. Going back to find the earliest videos…I couldn’t find any anomalies…and the youtubers making dino hoax videos apparently have had no such success either (or have been censored). Also this “bone war” with the development of original (and wrong) sketches of how they have looked is informative and appears legitimate. The msm (I believe the discovery channel) has made a video that feature dino truthers…which seemed to me like they were encouraging discussion on the topic. On that video and elsewhere museum curators say there are in fact real bones on display…so who exactly has proven that they are lying about this at all museums? I agree we are dealing with elites who may invert every argument possible to cause chaos and make truth sound like lies, so either way we have to rely on evidence. I don’t want to mention , but I must that many people supporting the dino hoax believe the earth was created 6k years ago...and this can also be said for FE, rapid mud fossils, volcanic oil, no gravity, no space arguments. I think it is very possible that this meme is engineered as dialectical hyperbole.
 
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TH Dialectic

TH Dialectic

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Now a Chinese book written around year 300 by Chang Qu reported the discovery of dragon bones. And allegedly there is a long history of the Chinese using these dragon bones in medicine. In Europe the bones were believed to be that of biblical giants. A partial femur was recovered from a quarry in 1676 England.
This seems like an appeal to ignorance, ignorance doesn't prove anything other than one doesn't know something.

In 1699 a buddy of Newton published the first scientism paper on what would eventually be called dinosaurs. So they did not invent the term dinosaur and only then find the bones…that is not the story unless you can prove the encyclopedias with references wrong.
Do you have any supporting evidence for these claims? How can something be eventually called something?

In 1800 Culvier found and named the ptero-dacty and Culvier was the main dude establishing extinction as accepted fact so this would be the guy to debunk, he looks fairly clean to me. And as the official story goes, in 1815 a Rev. Buckland starts categorizing dino bones as extinct animals. So note that it wasn’t until 1842 that Richard Owen coined the term dinosaur. Owen was putting these bones (or fake bones) on display in London. In 1858 dino bones were found in NJ, and allegedly it was an entire skeleton (the first entire skeleton was found in 1834 England). In 1877 there was a so-called 30 year “bone war”, with lots of drawings about where the head and tail and brain should be. This war was between 2 guys named Cope and Marsh, and supposedly these 2 guys unearthed and defined 142 new species, Marsh’s bones have been on display ever since at the Peabody Museum at Yale. The first mention of Dino’s in popular media was by Dickens 1842. Some shady company I admit. If the Chinese thing can be established and Culvier checks out then most of the hoax arguments fall flat.
We understand people have been arguing over large bones found in the floor for a long time granted, but this doesn't prove anything, does it? Maybe you can elaborate on this and enlighten me?

It is the sheer size of this psyop that would be stunning because I think it would trump most other psyops in history for its unmitigated success…allegedly a hundred thousand fake fossilized bones, buried by clever illuminati before being “discovered” by armies of paleontologists dupes? Or, all fraternity brothers without a single whistleblower? With zero Christian crusaders around writing books and exposing the forgeries?
A hundred thousand fake fossilised bones? We definitely have bones in the ground from previous dead animals / humans etc. I don't think anyone is claiming all of the bones are fake, that sounds like you are attacking a strawman here. That claim is the most ridiculous Dino claim to date .... Oh, actually buried by illuminati tops it! Palaeontologists don't have to be dupes, they are finding bones in the ground, could be from anything!! I’m pretty sure 99% of palaeontologists think they are finding Dinosaur bones and would tell you with absolute certainty they are Dinosaur bones! But that again is an appeal to consensus, no one knows what they actually are!

I don’t want to mention , but I must that many people supporting the dino hoax believe the earth was created 6k years ago...and this can also be said for FE, rapid mud fossils, volcanic oil, no gravity, no space arguments. I think it is very possible that this meme is engineered as dialectical hyperbole.
Very hasty generalisation to form a very illicit unwarranted conclusion. To conclude, you have brought nothing to the table other than alleged stories. Sorry for the baptism of fire I’m all for hypothesising ideas and free form thinking, but your bid to support Dinosauria will have to gain some weight before attempting to break these sceptical walls. I’m not claiming to know what these huge bones actually are, stories are sometimes best left for kids books.

TH
 

Dudermensch

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This seems like an appeal to ignorance, ignorance doesn't prove anything other than one doesn't know something.



Do you have any supporting evidence for these claims? How can something be eventually called something?



We understand people have been arguing over large bones found in the floor for a long time granted, but this doesn't prove anything, does it? Maybe you can elaborate on this and enlighten me?



A hundred thousand fake fossilised bones? , that sounds like you are attacking a strawman here. That claim is the most ridiculous Dino claim to date .... Oh, actually buried by illuminati tops it! Palaeontologists don't have to be dupes, they are finding bones in the ground, could be from anything!! I’m pretty sure 99% of palaeontologists think they are finding Dinosaur bones and would tell you with absolute certainty they are Dinosaur bones! But that again is an appeal to consensus, no one knows what they actually are!



Very hasty generalisation to form a very illicit unwarranted conclusion. To conclude, you have brought nothing to the table other than alleged stories. Sorry for the baptism of fire I’m all for hypothesising ideas and free form thinking, but your bid to support Dinosauria will have to gain some weight before attempting to break these sceptical walls. I’m not claiming to know what these huge bones actually are, stories are sometimes best left for kids books.

TH
"A very illicit unwarranted conclusion" ~?
"We definitely have bones in the ground from previous dead animals / humans etc. I don't think anyone is claiming all of the bones are fake"
oh in fact they are, they claim all the bones in the museums are fake and there are no giant animals, that the entire dinosaur thing is a hoax...did you not read the OP? Please provide me with someone who called out the dinosaur hoax before youtube existed, and if he has more evidence than bible thumping I will read it.
 
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TH Dialectic

TH Dialectic

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"A very illicit unwarranted conclusion" ~?
"We definitely have bones in the ground from previous dead animals / humans etc. I don't think anyone is claiming all of the bones are fake"
oh in fact they are, they claim all the bones in the museums are fake and there are no giant animals, that the entire dinosaur thing is a hoax...did you not read the OP? Please provide me with someone who called out the dinosaur hoax before youtube existed, and if he has more evidence than bible thumping I will read it.
We have a difference between fake bones on show at a museum and bones found in the ground- I think this could be where your wires are crossed. Bones that are found in the ground could belong to anything! The original post doesn't specify all bones are planted and fake. These bones on show in museums are fake yes due to the nature of how precious the real ones are, even the museum's say we can't use the real ones as it would be to significant of a risk to let the public wonder around them.

Again, this doesn't mean all bones found in the ground are fake.

We don't have palaeontologists plating and finding fake bones (maybe a couple by exception like we have fakes in anything historical). We have palaeontologists finding actual bones, then putting 2 and 2 together to make 19. Building huge Dino's from tiny bones like a jigsaw puzzle.

It would be like saying all ancient artefacts found are fakes. I’m quite sure the world of ancient artefacts is riddled with fakes. Anything coming from the ancient world has the chance to be monetised or used to build some sort of fictitious narrative.

I’m not coming from any religious stand point on this. Please refrain from your assumptions and keep your hasty generalisations to yourself.

TH
 

Archangelclk

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Great thread, I have always been fascinated with this topic and sought to find more info about it from the alternative worldviews!

16522

Personally, I believe that dinosaurs did exist, but not according to the mainstream, millions of years of evolution theory nonsense.
A couple things I believe based off of my research over many years:
  • Dinosaurs existed alongside man as attributed in sculpture, reliefs, general history, stories and legends of old
  • Within my Chinese heritage, we called them Dragons, however some of our traditions include Lion Dance which is very similar to a dino like creature with horns during Chinese New Year. Also called malaysian unicorn.
  • The earth's environmental conditions were vastly different, double pressure oxygen, less cellular deterioration, longer life span and larger reptilians which grow for the duration of their life. Think pre-flood ages in in the bible.
  • Some drawings and depictions of dinosaurs, skin color, patterns also known as dermal frills were drawn by older cultures prior to the excavation of any dino bones by modern man in the 1900s. (recently verified by preserved dino tissue)
  • Some ancient temple stonework of dinosaurs
  • Ancients called them by different names such as Serpents, Dragons by the Chinese, Mokele mbebe(one who stops the flow of rivers) by Africans etc
  • Post flood dinos could not survive based off of the change in oxygen and environmental conditions. Most died off suffocated, starved or were hunted by man
  • Bible mentions them as Behemoth, Leviathon, Serpent etc
  • Modern discoveries of dino blood cells in bone marrow and partially preserved tissue of dinos show dinos living not too long ago
  • American Dictionary 1891: The Word Dinosaur didn’t even exist before the 1840’s; even in 1891 the word dinosaur was still not in the American dictionary.
  • Most of the remains and fossils are hard to find and rare as global flood wiped much of the dinosaurs away, albeit much of the existing fossils were preserved by rapid flood water and mud, minerals
  • Many dinosaurs have been fossilized in a 'Death Pose' with their heads arched far back due to drowning
Definition Dragon
16520
16521
 
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Willielad

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We have a difference between fake bones on show at a museum and bones found in the ground- I think this could be where your wires are crossed. Bones that are found in the ground could belong to anything! The original post doesn't specify all bones are planted and fake. These bones on show in museums are fake yes due to the nature of how precious the real ones are, even the museum's say we can't use the real ones as it would be to significant of a risk to let the public wonder around them.

Again, this doesn't mean all bones found in the ground are fake.

We don't have palaeontologists plating and finding fake bones (maybe a couple by exception like we have fakes in anything historical). We have palaeontologists finding actual bones, then putting 2 and 2 together to make 19. Building huge Dino's from tiny bones like a jigsaw puzzle.

It would be like saying all ancient artefacts found are fakes. I’m quite sure the world of ancient artefacts is riddled with fakes. Anything coming from the ancient world has the chance to be monetised or used to build some sort of fictitious narrative.

I’m not coming from any religious stand point on this. Please refrain from your assumptions and keep your hasty generalisations to yourself.

TH
And of course no bones have ever been found period. Just supposedly bone shaped rocks. There are no bones at all.
 

Red Bird

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This first link below is really interesting. The are many stories of pleiosaurus sightings in lochs, Andes and primitive jungle even now.
I live where there is a dinosaur museum with many triceritop heads found in my state (basically different rhinos?)...don’t believe the ages but there were weird animals.

On my iPad and it doesn’t like my touch for direct links tonight- sorry.

( these are from that bill cooper link/British history)
Dinosaurs from Anglo-Saxon and other records
Dinosaurs from Anglo-Saxon and other Records

Beowulf and creatures of denmark
Beowulf and the Creatures of Denmark
 

Archangelclk

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I personally believe that we have found numerous dinosaur bones, fossils imprinted into layers of sediment which range from a thousand-a few thousand years. The puluxy river is also known by creationists as a site of many human footprints alongside dino tracks because of the unique conditions which caused fossilization there.

While most dino finds yield maybe 50% or less of the full skeleton, we do have enough variations of the different kinds and or multiples of specific kinds to get a good idea of how they looked like. Some of the dinosaurs portrayed in mainstream movies and paleontology like the T-Rex may not have been Apex predators. For example, the T-rex is quite off balance, poor eyesight and has a certain range of speed. Its olfactory senses were excellent and its teeth would easily break off in prey(found in preserved finds and other fossil remains). This type of sense of smell and easily broken teeth growing back is common among certain scavengers which are alive today.
 
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TH Dialectic

TH Dialectic

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I personally believe that we have found numerous dinosaur bones, fossils imprinted into layers of sediment which range from a thousand-a few thousand years. The puluxy river is also known by creationists as a site of many human footprints alongside dino tracks because of the unique conditions which caused fossilization there.

While most dino finds yield maybe 50% or less of the full skeleton, we do have enough variations of the different kinds and or multiples of specific kinds to get a good idea of how they looked like. Some of the dinosaurs portrayed in mainstream movies and paleontology like the T-Rex may not have been Apex predators. For example, the T-rex is quite off balance, poor eyesight and has a certain range of speed. Its olfactory senses were excellent and its teeth would easily break off in prey(found in preserved finds and other fossil remains). This type of sense of smell and easily broken teeth growing back is common among certain scavengers which are alive today.
We don't know what was happening 120 years ago, never mind 200,000,000 years ago. Large extinct animals did absolutely walk/fly our plane but to be able to categorise and tell us characteristics about said animals is mental.

Scepticism unfolding more scepticism, loving the input so far.

TH
 
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BrokenAgate

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Even MORE betterer! New Birdlike Dinosaur Had Modern Feathers The drawing is a reconstruction of Jianianhualong tengi , which is kind of a grandiose name for something that they even admit looks like a chicken. But wait, where is the actual fossil? It would have been nice if the author of this article had included that, or at least a link to it. This sloppy journalism really annoys me. The actual fossil is in the Wikipedia article, here: Jianianhualong - Wikipedia It does seem to be a fairly complete fossil of something with a long tail and a triangular, toothy head. There is also a PDF describing, in detail, the entire fossil, if anyone cares to read a lengthy scientific article.
The images are low-res at both these articles. I am not sure how they are concluding that this creature had feathers, as the feather impressions don't seem to be visible in these crappy photographs. Is that really the best they can do? Don't these archaeologists have access to high-quality cameras that can take the best pictures that government grant money can buy? Then why don't we get to see those images? These ones are no better than what I could take with my phone's camera.
 

whitewave

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The bones of giants that have been unearthed turn to dust when graves/mounds are opened. Since academia insists human like beings came along much later than dinosaurs, how is it that dino bones are still strong enough to withstand transportation and museum displaying? Sixty-five MILLION years ago and bones are still intact? The stuff we're expected to believe!
 

0harris0

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never understood the closeness to surface of a lot of the dino skellys! some of the dino 'graveyards' look as though they could have died in fairly recent catastrophe in the last few thousand years..
maybe the 'fossils' are all actually still bone material, and very very brittle, hence why they wrap them in casts and don't display them! i don't see how bones that have fossilized into stone can be brittle.
seems.. legit?
really good links, certainly sheds a new light on the tales of old!
Jianianhualong tengi
it's a pheasant! :ROFLMAO:
Post automatically merged:

also- not sure if this is posted elsewhere but a very interesting Ted from a pretty funny paleontologist!

speaks a lot of sense! then look at any dino "family tree" and it becomes a bit of a joke!
 
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